Author Topic: IMC brush-clearing  (Read 105509 times)

CIOR

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #680 on: August 07, 2016, 09:29:16 PM »
It's been speculated the clover leaf side would be cut in the middle at some point and once the cut is done then the balance toward Frankfort will come up. 

As for the IMC portion, NS had the chance to render it done, but at the time the whole lease to Kokomo Grain north of Tipton was in the works. So NS went along, now im.betting they wished they had let the INDOT pull the plug for the overpass on new US31.

YES, Kokomo grain is a BIG shipper, and they have several elevators.  Kokomo, Winamac, Amboy, Edinburgh and now RF at Frankton. 

I'll sorta walk out on the limb and say the Clover Leaf is in such bad shape even a large outfit like GW would give a healthy pause at rebuilding it.  I also wonder what provisions in kokomo for the roadway would or have been made since the overpass Removal.

I bleed red

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #681 on: August 09, 2016, 10:16:22 AM »
I piloted a spray truck last summer from Forrest towards Frankfart. My opinion is it would be good for 10mph as is. It would definitely need a tie and surface job. Most if not all county roads will need unburied. The sr26 xing in Rusiaville would need put back in. Bridges and culverts inspected and brought back up to specs. Also would need many,many trees hacked down in the West Middleton area that i can vouch for. I would love to buy this entire line from one to the other bu alas I'm just a poor railroader.

scheblo25

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #682 on: August 12, 2016, 09:45:58 PM »
The reason neither the IMC or Cloverleaf west of Kokomo have been put up for abandonment is simple. Once NS files the paper work, Kokomo Grain can swoop in and file an offer of financial assistance and through legal proceedings can gain access to CSX either at Frankfort or connect to the HHPA at Tipton. NS wants the grain traffic for itself so they let the lines sit in the weeds.

That's very interesting.   If that's the case it's quite an impressive stand off.   I'd love to see Chrysler ask for rail service again on the south side. 

STLX 7000

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #683 on: November 29, 2019, 02:09:48 AM »
It's bigger than Kokomo Grain.  If IMC is put up for abandonment, an OFA from Genesee & Wyoming could include provisions for trackage rights into Frankfort which would have a legitimate chance of being approved.  If Cloverleaf goes up, G&W is in Frankfort.  Remember, NS could see writing on the wall and made the strategic decision in late 90's to split up the Central (CIND/CERA).  The only thing that has changed since then is the owner of CIND/CERA is healthier now than the owners back then.  Back in 1991, Conrail went against the wishes of Norfolk Southern and granted the CIND permanent unrestricted trackage rights into Frankfort.   NS was concerned back then and still has a level of concern today that someday a regional would get it's act together or worse, the regional would sell to a western carrier and suddenly you have a western carrier in Cincinnati swiping high dollar traffic from NS.  CIND and IORY are both full members of the Cincinnati switching district.  This means that they can solicit traffic in and out of any open customer.  This is how IORY handles a substantial amount Proctor and Gamble traffic to the chagrin of Norfolk Southern who does the dirty work on spotting and pull for a set fee just to turn traffic over to IORY at Sharonville for IORY to get the lion share of the line haul going north.  Currently, CSXT's ownership of the CFE, and NS's  brick wall of IMC/Cloverleaf separating CIND/CERA keeps the status quo in check.  Break down one of those wall, it could be a different game.

In light of changes to the Kokomo rail scene in the past year, with USRail getting the boot and Central resuming operations on the WSRY, what is the likelihood of NS dumping the IMC or Cloverleaf? It seems NS is in a major cut anything that doesn't produce mode. I can't imagine the property taxes NS has paid on these lines in close to 20 years of inactivity. I know now the IMC south of Tipton option is dead, but reactivation to Tipton and trackage rights to Frankfort seems to be much less costly than relaying the abandoned Cloverleaf in Kokomo and rehabbing the rest to Frankfort. Pipe dream I know, but in this day in age of wacky short term Class one group think, maybe G&W could make some moves here.

NS7112

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #684 on: November 29, 2019, 09:01:04 PM »
It's never made sense to me why they take the grain trains to Marion.  They have to run the power around the train and add to that more mileage than to just go direct to Tipton.  Goes south anyways. 

central1751

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #685 on: December 01, 2019, 11:35:13 PM »
They have removed crossings at Markland Avenue and Southway Bvld in Kokomo.  Would take millions to rehab the IMC from Kokomo to Tipton between rail/tie condition, crossings removed, crossing flashers removed or damaged.  NS took the flashers from Alto road to reuse elsewhere I assume as they were newer stuff.  I keep watching for cast iron ones from Southway to be taken down so I can see if I can get one full set, pole and all as this was my childhood train watching spot growing up.  They cannot reuse the cast iron stuff, so maybe there is a chance to save one of those set ups.  I do not see the IMC ever seeing a train again and will probably end up a trail since the IMC to the north is part of the trail scene and that trail kind of dead ends down near the bridge over the Kokomo Creek near 931. I wonder if they are waiting to be able to run that trail further south into the southern suburbs of Kokomo. 

monty

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #686 on: August 10, 2020, 09:47:47 PM »
So why isnít this old section of the IMC abandoned and pulled up?  Now that the Tipton - Noblesville - Indy IMC debacle is settled and the old CERA Lines seem assured of a reasonable life in serving Kokomo Grain (Kokomo location) by the very solid G&W group via the Cloverleaf line to Marion (complete with some overhead Logan to Marion traffic)?  I lament that the IMC from Tipton to Kokomo was so close to a revitalization of great magnitude only to return to weeds and trees and removed street crossings. Just curious why NS hasnít hasnít officially pulled the plug.
monty

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #687 on: August 11, 2020, 03:26:44 PM »
So why isnít this old section of the IMC abandoned and pulled up?  Now that the Tipton - Noblesville - Indy IMC debacle is settled and the old CERA Lines seem assured of a reasonable life in serving Kokomo Grain (Kokomo location) by the very solid G&W group via the Cloverleaf line to Marion (complete with some overhead Logan to Marion traffic)?  I lament that the IMC from Tipton to Kokomo was so close to a revitalization of great magnitude only to return to weeds and trees and removed street crossings. Just curious why NS hasnít hasnít officially pulled the plug.

This is just me speculating, but maybe they're keeping it in case something happens that they do have to bypass the old Cloverleaf. Again, just my thought on the matter.

Bob Durnell

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #688 on: August 12, 2020, 07:31:01 AM »
Nothing NS has done in this whole area ever made a ton of sense to me.  Why was the Clover Leaf between Van Buren and Marion never officially abandoned, when half the track isn't even there anymore? If you can find the answer to that one, maybe you can find the answer to the rest......

rrnut282

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Re: IMC brush-clearing
« Reply #689 on: August 12, 2020, 02:05:58 PM »
The simple answer (and nothing is ever simple in railroading) is if NS has it, nobody else can use it to make money NS should be getting. 
rrnut2-8-2
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