Author Topic: NKP Trail Updates  (Read 22121 times)

BourdonBoy

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #20 on: August 31, 2018, 11:09:19 AM »
Another filing was recorded yesterday, this one from the National Association Of Reversionary Property Owners.  Apparently, in 1991 NARPO was representing four adjacent property owners near Noblesville.

https://www.stb.gov/FILINGS/all.nsf/c72552abc289f85285257515007219bd/f04dc7d37349d806852582fa0042c0da/$FILE/246290.pdf

Here is NARPO's "website":
http://home.earthlink.net/~dick156/row.htm

AlcoGuy

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2018, 12:42:35 PM »
So if I'm reading this right, if NS DID consummate abandonment, would that mean the lines current owners would then have to reapply, thus opening up the line for a OFA? Frankly, this has me a bit confused...

IndyHog

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2018, 12:48:12 PM »
Can't remember the scenario with the Monon Trail. Is it railbanked? How did Indianapolis and Carmel get the deed to the land?
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AlcoGuy

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2018, 01:03:26 PM »
The city of Indianapolis bought the bare strip of land from 10thSt in Indy to 96thSt from SBD/CSX for 3.5 million. Carmel jumped in a few years later, but don't have what they paid readily available.

IndyHog

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2018, 02:37:12 PM »
Thanks AlcoGuy.   I wonder where these Reversionary Property Owners were then. Apparently the City of Indpls and CSX didn't have this kind of opposition.
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DUPER

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2018, 08:23:07 PM »
I simply don't see the benefit of a single uninterrupted trail between Noblesville and 96th st at the present time.  I don't see how local politicians or cronies could make much profit off of it.  The idea that Fishers and Noblesville want the train gone to make road construction easier makes sense.

However, the land near the airport is desirable for development, and the rail ROW does get in the way.

I could see a future where Fishers builds a trail from its ever growing high density urban core down to whatever develops near the airport, but a trail from anyplace south of 146th street up to Noblesville would seem not very useful, not to mention the expense it would be to build something to cross 146th st. 

NS7112

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #26 on: September 02, 2018, 01:56:01 PM »
I simply don't see the benefit of a single uninterrupted trail between Noblesville and 96th st at the present time.  I don't see how local politicians or cronies could make much profit off of it.  The idea that Fishers and Noblesville want the train gone to make road construction easier makes sense.

However, the land near the airport is desirable for development, and the rail ROW does get in the way.

I could see a future where Fishers builds a trail from its ever growing high density urban core down to whatever develops near the airport, but a trail from anyplace south of 146th street up to Noblesville would seem not very useful, not to mention the expense it would be to build something to cross 146th st.

Have you ridden the Monon north of 146th?  Apparently not...Trail goes into much more rural(if you can still really call it that) area than the area north of 146th on the IMC and itís very popular !!  Not even really touching Westfield either...

CSX_CO

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #27 on: September 02, 2018, 02:53:18 PM »
I guess the success of the rail trails in Wisconsin should be ignored too.  Only go through rural country side.  Who wants to see that?

DUPER

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #28 on: September 02, 2018, 03:59:45 PM »
Not sure I understand the responses about things being rural.  The NKP trail would go from 146th street to downtown Noblesville.  Its just a bunch of commercial buildings and residential subdivisions, not rural.  North of Noblesville would remain rail for the dinner train across Morse.

146th street to fishers goes behind car dealerships, a cement company, then more subdivisions. 

I guess I don't see the appeal.  It would seem like a wasted project to me.

I think the MONON from Carmel to broad ripple was popular at one time, but I think its gotten to be a nuisance more than a benefit. 


trainmaster53

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #29 on: September 02, 2018, 04:42:42 PM »
They call it, To Much Crime along the Monon Trail. People do not like the feeling of it not being Safe any more. This is the same thing that the People of Noblesville and Fishers are saying, We don't want the Crime in our neighbor hood. And the Mayors will not listen to the People. "VOTE THEM OUT", Problem solved..

Don_Worsham

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #30 on: September 02, 2018, 09:26:48 PM »
I guess the success of the rail trails in Wisconsin should be ignored too.  Only go through rural country side.  Who wants to see that?

The Nickle Plate Trail North of Cassville thru Peru to Rochester is very rural and lightly used.
A nice walk.

Cardinal Greenway North from Richmond to Marion, nice and very rural. Typical of most trails on former rail right-of-ways.
Another nice walk.

Why go to Wisconsin to find a trail. Looking for a weekend project? Go count the number of people who use these trails. Try the Wabash River bridge as a starting point.

Used to live in Peru, some parts of the Nickel Plate Trail are used more than others.

Crossed the Cardinal Greenways, the C&O right-of-way from Richmond north to Marion, at Losantville many time on the way to Greenville, Ohio. Nicely done. All asphalt. Never say a single person using it.

CSX_CO

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #31 on: September 02, 2018, 10:56:21 PM »
Wisconsin has marketed their trails to the biking community.  You can go from a Mineral Point to Monroe, north to Madison, and back west to Dodgeville on interconnected rail trails.  Dodgeville connects to a State Park via trail too.  Thatís just 3 trails.  There are additional trails around those too.

You start an interconnected network of trails around central Indiana, a biker could ride for a couple of days on individual trails, with one starting location.  B&O trail pushing west (saw several people using it despite crappy weather this past spring), Monon Trail, NKP trail (which could eventually go from Indy to Rochester using CR roads to fill gaps), PRR trail conversion, etc.

xgap

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #32 on: September 03, 2018, 12:08:46 AM »
Just for fun, would like to see the cost of some of these vs the number of users.
Rode the C&O at Marion a while back. Saw only two people over a period of six hours. The fewer users added to some safety issues.
In New Albany, Mayor Gahan has eliminated some driving lanes for bicycle. As cross town traffic is now choked down, one has extra time to count the number of bikes but there is none.   

Rick

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #33 on: September 03, 2018, 12:28:09 AM »
Itís going to take a long time to get the trails in Indiana popular enough for them to be used by the biking community more.  Iím not talking about the occasional biker either.  They do use them occasionally up here but mostly stick to the roads as such because there arenít long enough trails connecting one another.  Even the pumpkinvine up here gets used more from the Amish than any biking group.  Itís never been busy when Iíve been on it.  I like it that way but I only use it a few times a year. 


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trafficcritic

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #34 on: September 05, 2018, 11:10:01 AM »
They call it, To Much Crime along the Monon Trail. People do not like the feeling of it not being Safe any more. This is the same thing that the People of Noblesville and Fishers are saying, We don't want the Crime in our neighbor hood. And the Mayors will not listen to the People. "VOTE THEM OUT", Problem solved..

I have ridden my bike on the Monon dozens of times and never once did I feel unsafe... There seems to be a myth circulating that the Monon brings in a lot of crime. Well, by that definition, roads and sidewalks tend to attract crime too, don't they!

The value of the Monon as a park/destination itself, outweighs any negative effects or crime that may happen once in awhile along the trail. Plus the economic activity that is generated by the Monon Trail is also going to beat out the crime component.

When people have good, safe facilities to walk/bike to their destination rather than driving, the land values around these trails will increase as the nearby residents come to appreciate the benefits over the risk.


AlcoGuy

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #35 on: September 05, 2018, 11:52:23 AM »
Surely you must be kidding. Outweighs any crime that may happen? Just tell that to the young ladys family who was recently sexually assaulted, or the business owner in Broad Ripple who was robbed just last week and the trail used as a getaway route (this is very common). Perhaps you, as I have, should speak to adjacent property owners and businesses? They will tell you crime is prolific and a MAJOR problem, backyard sheds broken into regularly, bike's stolen, trespassing, liter in everyone's back yard to name but a few. Two guys were assaulted near 61st just a couple months ago. Property values going up? NOPE..not according to the people I've spoke with as they actually went down since nobody wants a trail with complete and total strangers" stumbling around in our backyards at all hours of the day and night". I would urge you to do a search on the net on Monon crime problems. Page after page of nothing but crime. And guess what? Crimes were NONEXISTENT before the trail.

CSX_CO

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2018, 11:56:36 AM »
If trails are a conveyor belt for crime, we better rip out roads too. 

Perhaps if punishment for crimes deterred crime, it wouldnít be so prevalent. 

Shoot, we had an attempted break in here in my neighborhood.  We live in the boonies.  It can happen anywhere, not just along trails.

Besides, if the neighborhoods the NKP trail go through are so bad, why would anyone want to ride a train through them then?

AlcoGuy

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2018, 12:30:53 PM »
While I get your point, the difference is WE HAVE TO HAVE ROADS AND STREETS. We don't HAVE TO HAVE trails. And yes, if people were actually held accountable for their actions and prosecuted for the crimes they commit, perhaps that would act as a reason to not commit said crimes, knowing they will spend some time "in the hole".

trainmaster53

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Re: NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #38 on: September 05, 2018, 12:52:18 PM »
And to add to that, Show me where Trails make Money. They don't even Collect any Taxes on them either. A waste of Tax Dollars that we Fund.

Rick

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NKP Trail Updates
« Reply #39 on: September 05, 2018, 01:30:15 PM »
While I get your point, the difference is WE HAVE TO HAVE ROADS AND STREETS. We don't HAVE TO HAVE trails. And yes, if people were actually held accountable for their actions and prosecuted for the crimes they commit, perhaps that would act as a reason to not commit said crimes, knowing they will spend some time "in the hole".
Part of the problem is people donít care about the punishment.  This may sound cold hearted but trust me, if I see you breaking into my shed, house, car whatever on my property you wonít have to worry about punishment.  You wonít be around to receive it.  Thereís a reason why other countries with strict laws against any crime have much less crime than here.  Add to the fact that in todayís family culture, respect is not a high value being instilled these days, nor has it for some time, just adds to the problem.


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